Leading Red Bull back from the brink

A dust-up with security at one of Abu Dhabi's swishest hotels. "No pictures!" says the heavy, who's just clocked photographer Glenn Dunbar's lights-and-tripod set-up, carefully arranged to create the images you see on this page.

Our man (dark shades, dark suit, no smile) is clearly not biddable, so we use that old Formula 1 trick: a flash of the hard card and the off-loading of a few 'name-drop' bombs. "This shoot is with a Formula 1 team boss - Christian Horner. You know, he's in charge of Red Bull. Abu Dhabi Grand Prix? Formula 1? Bernie Ecclestone?"

A crack in the edifice. A mumble into the wrist-mounted comms-link.

The hotel chain's head of marketing, no less, is summoned, and, a few honeyed sentences later, we're granted permission to continue going about our business. And not before time, for just as our hosts depart to deal with other matters of import, Mr Horner arrives, hot-foot from the Yas Marina paddock.

It's two years almost to the day since we last had proper, on-the-record face time with Christian, and in a reflective moment before we begin our interview, he notes how quickly things can change - even as they appear to stay the same.

He is still, of course, team principal of Red Bull Racing, which remains one of the most powerful competitive and political forces in F1, regardless of 2015's engine-partner travails.

His paymasters continue to bankroll two slick, competitive and colourful Formula 1 teams, along with their own home grand prix at the Red Bull Ring in Austria. Adrian Newey still heads up the RBR design brains trust; Renault still provides the motive force; an Australian continues to occupy one of its race seats.

All of these constituent parts were in place at the end of 2013, when Christian and co were able to reflect on jobs exceedingly well done over the previous four seasons: between 2010 and '13, Red Bull and Sebastian Vettel notched up four constructors' and drivers' title doubles.

How things have changed. A slip to fourth in last year's constructors' chase, with only three podium finishes (in 2014 Red Bull was second, with three wins); no Vettel out front, and a Renault power unit that not only lacked where it mattered - under the drivers' right feet - but also proved so unreliable and uncompetitive that it created a rancorous schism between team and supplier. Red Bull overlord Dietrich Mateschitz even came close to quitting F1.

Quite a bit, then, to manage, for a team boss who's hard-wired to be as competitive and as shrewd as they come in the practice of F1's political dark arts. Over a mocktail (mine) and a cranberry juice (his), Christian opens up on how it's all been, since '13.

Engine problems blighted Red Bull in 2015 © LAT

F1 Racing: Has this been the hardest year of your life in racing?

Christian Horner: It's been challenging, but in a different way. When you're running at the front it's challenging because you've got the pressure of staying there. There are the challenges of getting into a competitive situation in the first place. I'd say 2015 has probably been one of the most frustrating years, but not the most challenging.

F1R: How would you define the difference between 'challenging' and 'frustrating'?

CH: 'Challenging' is things you can control; 'frustrating' is the things you can't. I think that's been a large element of this year. Certain things have been beyond my control, or the team's control, such as power units, which have obviously dominated our season on- and off- track this year.

Not half they have. Few would have expected things to disintegrate so far, so fast between partners who carried all before them for four seasons.

What became clear over 2014-15 is that Renault dramatically underestimated the resource Mercedes was prepared to bring to F1 in its own quest for title glory as a 'works' entrant.

Renault, still wedded to working practices and funding that had proved successful only under the shelter of stable V10 and V8 engine regulations, could do no more than look on, breathless, as Merc changed the game. Nonetheless, it's with a Mario Ilien-modded, TAG Heuer-badged Renault PU that Red Bull must compete in 2016, although for 2017 all bets are off. Thus, we're aware that we're about to tread on sensitive ground.

F1R: Your engine deal for 2016 is resolved... isn't it?

CH: We've got an agreement in place for next year. [Christian is speaking just before the TAG deal is announced. At the time of this interview, the Thursday of the Abu Dhabi GP weekend, the final details of Renault's F1 involvement were still being thrashed out, culminating in a heated paddock showdown on the morning of race day.] The important thing is we have a solution to be on the grid for 2016, because at one stage it looked as if that wouldn't be the case.

F1R: That was as recently as September 2015?

CH: Yes.

F1R: So it was true that the team might have not raced in 2016?

CH: Absolutely - 100 per cent.

F1R: So how much of a 'sell' did you have to do to Dietrich Mateschitz [Red Bull's billionaire founder-owner] to say: "Look, this is a tricky time but you need to be in F1"?

Mateschitz, despite being a motorsport fan, whose first sponsored athlete was Austrian F1 driver Gerhard Berger, is famously ruthless in terminating business ventures that have ceased to align with the wider interests of the Red Bull brand.

CH: He's obviously been frustrated by the politics that surround Formula 1, and earlier in the year became fairly disillusioned with what was playing out.

[Mateschitz believed he'd shaken hands with Mercedes F1's non-executive chairman Niki Lauda on a future engine supply deal - only to see it evaporate.]

But beneath it all, Dietrich is a racer and he is passionate about this sport. You've only got to look at what he has invested in his two teams, the sport in general and all the drivers he has backed and supported, to recognise that this is much more than just a commercial exercise. It is the passion of an individual. He recognises that this has been a tough period for the team, and he is trying to help find a solution for the medium and long-term future as well.

F1R: What timeframe do 'medium-' and 'long-term' encompass?

CH: I'd say 'medium-term' is the next three to four years, and 'long-term' is five years and beyond.

F1R: That's 2020 and beyond?

CH: Yes.

Red Bull's future now looks more secure © LAT

F1R: So to confirm, from your point of view, Mateschitz sees Red Bull in Formula 1 beyond 2020, when the team's existing financial arrangements with Formula One Management cease?

CH: You can never say never, it depends on what direction the sport takes. But as long as things move in the right direction and Formula 1 remains credible and viable, then I don't see any reason why not.

F1R: What is the 'right direction'? How do you define that?

CH: First of all you've got to remove that remit from the teams, as they will look to protect their own interests. We are competitive animals and teams will try to protect the areas of strength that they perceive they have. I think that's really where it is the job of the owners and the promoters of the sport to decide what they want Formula 1 to be.

My personal feeling is that Formula 1 needs to be entertainment; it needs to be a show. It needs to be man and machine at the absolute limit. It needs to be enthralling, engaging and accessible - and it shouldn't be dominated by the politics of off-track activities.

F1R: Has F1 shifted too far from these aspects you identify?

CH: I think so. I think we're seeing teams that are really struggling financially, with probably half the grid insolvent at the moment. We've got a situation where we've got one car capable of doing all the serial winning over a long period of time.

People will say that Red Bull did that, but we never did it to the extent we've seen in the past two years. Two of our four championships went down to the last race. In 2012 we had seven different winners in the first seven races, and Sebastian had won only one race by the time we left Europe.

I think the performance differentiator that a power unit currently represents is too great between the best to the worst. No one wants to see Fernando Alonso at the back of the grid. McLaren are a great team, but they shouldn't be as far back as they are. I think it is in the sport's interest to see the group concertina up, so we see fights between the Ricciardos, the Vettels, the Hamiltons and the Alonsos. I think that is what the sport needs. If you're the promoter of it then that's what you would want to see.

Read between the lines here and you'll see that Horner would like F1 to be revamped, particularly in terms of its on-track offering, but - canny operator that he is - he stops short of criticising the sport's incumbent masters. A lot has changed for both F1 and Red Bull since it first appeared in the championship (pictured below).

F1R: You mention McLaren needing to get back to being frontrunners, as they were in 2005, when you entered F1. But isn't F1 all about highs and lows, as you're experiencing? You came in, immediately took the team on from where they had been [as Jaguar Racing] in 2004; then there were a few seasons of gradual gain before four years of great success. Last year was tricky, this year has been worse than 2014. What's it like being on that roller coaster?

CH: It's tough, because in the beginning you're striving and believing you can get there. You're working flat-out to put the pieces in place, and it took all of 2005, '06 and '07 to get the basics of the team and the infrastructure in place.

So when the new regulations came about during 2008 for the 2009 season - in 2008 we'd produced a reasonable car under the existing regulations, but then the 2009 year was a blank canvas - that was a chance for the team to show what we were capable of.

As a team we were still quite immature, but suddenly we had a car capable of winning. Of course there were all the politics off-track with FOTA and FOM and double-diffusers. But we focused on building the team and by 2010 were in a position to capitalise on that hard work, winning the title and then defending it repeatedly for another three years - and with each year came more and more pressure.

There was never any expectation of turning up to the race, bagging pole and walking away with the win. I don't ever remember attending a grand prix with that expectation.
Then, of course, the big regulation change came for 2014.

We had a very competitive 2013 [a title double and an incredible winning margin of 236 points over Mercedes], and you start to get used to your drivers being in the press conference at the end of qualifying, or being on the podium at the end of the race, and then suddenly that wasn't the case any more. You have to mentally readjust and it is very easy to let motivation wane at a time like that. But having tasted that success and worked so hard to get there we remained absolutely focused.

Mercedes did a great job with their power unit in terms of the new regs, but in 2014, on the days when they screwed up we were there to capitalise, through good strategy. The rest of the power units - the Ferrari and the Renault - were relatively evenly matched. The problem we faced going into 2015, having won three grands prix in 2014, was that an awful lot of promises were made about narrowing the gap to Mercedes in 2015.

Red Bull-Renault relationship was tested last year, the team having expected more from its engine partner © LAT

F1R: From Renault?

CH: From Renault, and therefore expectations were raised. When you are a competitive team who want to compete to win, that's what you're pushing for. So of course when that didn't happen, frustration sets in. From frustration comes annoyance, because at the end of the day we are all competitive people.

This year has been really challenging, because the power unit is not something we've had any control over. We had some issues with the car at the start of the year that we managed to engineer our way out of. We developed it and demonstrated that actually we've got a very fine chassis. You could see that in the middle sector at Spa for example, or the races in Hungary, Singapore and Monaco. Wherever power wasn't a key factor.

F1R: Like Texas when it was wet?

CH: Texas when it was wet, yes, certainly - you saw Daniel Ricciardo take the lead there. It was probably the only time that Lewis Hamilton was overtaken all year! They were reassuring moments, which demonstrated that we'd definitely still got it and that the car was still competitive. We just needed to get ourselves into a more competitive position with the power unit.

F1R: So, when you go through patches such as the 2015 summer break, when it was all quite sticky for Red Bull, with hard words being written by various media outlets, what was that like for you? What sort of conversations do you have with the guys you lead? Do you have to stand up in the factory and say 'we've got to make this right'? How do you deal with that and how do you deal with the wider Red Bull question, being part of a global brand that has its own marketing expectations beyond Formula 1? That must be a complicating factor, because on the one side they are an amazing backer, but equally they're a very demanding company to satisfy...

CH: So much of the world that we live in today seems to happen on social media and on the internet. So much speculation exists... and of course it's an interesting story when there is nothing going on in Formula 1, this whole engine scenario and the uncertainty surrounding Red Bull and whether they would pull out or stay in.

The 750-odd members of our staff all read that and of course it's unsettling for everyone. But right from the start, it has always been a matter of communicating, getting the group together and saying: "These are the things we can control and these are the things we can't. Let's concentrate on the things we can control and be the best that we can, and the rest will take care of itself."

We've had a very low turnover in staff and the group have really knuckled down into developing this car and turning it into a podium-achieving car. It's been a tough experience for the team, but adversity brings a team closer together. It's my job to bring the group together and keep them focused on the things they should be focused on.

F1R: Do you find yourself going home and thinking to yourself: 'How will I do this, how do I lead the team, what do I tell them?'

CH: No, I never do that, because I react to situations as they happen. I think that if you doubt yourself in moments of toughness then in this business you don't last that long. I've never had any doubt that we won't be on the grid in 2016.

I've always relayed that to all of the staff and in my mind I absolutely believe that. How to achieve that has not always been absolutely clear to me, but I've known that it will be achieved and that we will be there and we will get ourselves into a better position. I think when you're in a position of responsibility and people are looking up to you then you have to lead from the front.

F1R: So when you were thinking that you'd be in Formula 1 in 2016 come what may, did you ever consider that might have to be without Red Bull?

CH: No, because I didn't have any doubt that despite Dietrich's frustration with the situation, when push came to shove there was too much invested in the team, in the people, and by him personally. If he had decided to pull out then we'd have looked at that and dealt with that. You deal with what you can - with the now, rather than thinking about tomorrows that might never happen.

F1R: Did 'Christian Horner Racing' cross your mind, like, say, Brawn GP in 2009?

CH: No. People wrote about it, but no, my pure goal was to convince the group that it was right to stay in Formula 1.

Marko helped convince Mateschitz that F1 was worthwhile © XPB

F1R: 'The group' as in the Red Bull group?

CH: Yes.

F1R: Did the group take a lot of convincing? Was it a hard sell?

CH: At times, yes, and I think that is where Helmut [Marko, Red Bull motorsport adviser] played an important role because he is particularly close to Dietrich. Bernie played a key role in that as well, as he desperately doesn't want to lose Red Bull. I think in terms of promoting Formula 1, Red Bull does more than any other team. In terms of running show cars and driver promotions and so on, we are very, very active globally with promoting the sport.

F1R: Did you ever think: 'This is all just a bit too difficult; I might go off and do something else?'

CH: Not for one minute! It's a bit like a game of chess - trying to work out which is the right move. It's been a complicated year, but what's been interesting - and you have to take it as a back-handed compliment, which is something I've told the staff on numerous occasions - is how much fear and paranoia seems to exist about Red Bull among our opponents. To generate that kind of paranoia from our major opposition only demonstrates how strong this team must be.

F1R: One leading F1 journalist described you last year as an "aggressively competitive" team. Is that a fair description?

CH: It's an interesting way of putting it. If you want to be successful in life, or sport, then you've got to push, otherwise you're happy just to be there and take part. That's not what I'm about. That's not what Red Bull are about. That's not why we've won 50 grands prix and eight world championships. I don't think Frank Williams is like that; I don't think Ron Dennis is like that. People have different ways of conducting their business, but if you want to be successful, not just in this sport but in any sport, then you've got to push. You've got to push the boundaries.

F1R: So which boundaries will Red Bull be pushing next year?

CH: We're probably set for quite a challenging first quarter in 2016, but then with each new power unit, the situation should improve. That clearly and realistically has to be the goal.

F1R: You've done quite well commercially recently, haven't you? Signing TAG Heuer, for example, and Puma...

CH: We've signed some interesting new partnerships and some great brands, yes - TAG Heuer being one of them. We've also renewed many of our existing partnerships. The team has a real attraction and appeal, and to attract brands such as TAG, who have been synonymous with McLaren for so many years, demonstrates the commercial value that Red Bull hold, even after such a difficult year. People believe in the future. Yes we've been down this year, but we will be back - it's only a matter of time.

F1R: Do you think that your facilities in Milton Keynes limit you in any way? [Red Bull's collection of utilitarian factory units on an out-of-town industrial estate are a far cry from the glitzy architectural fanfare of McLaren's Technology Centre]

CH: Not at all. They might not be in the shiniest of buildings, but it's about what's inside, not what the buildings look like. We could do with a bigger car park and a better canteen, but the rest of it... there's nothing that is holding us back.

Even after some of '15's harder moments, Horner was usually able to find a smile © XPB

F1R: You come across as pretty good-humoured most of the time, and you usually give a good account of yourself in terms of banter on television when you're being interviewed. How do you manage that?

CH: You've got to take a view on a certain situation. I'm not the type of person who bawls and screams. I'll weigh up a situation and deal with it accordingly. There are certain things that you can control and certain things that you can't. The things that you can't... well, there's no point stressing yourself out over them because getting stressed and wound up isn't going to be a good use of my time, and ultimately it's not going to achieve anything. So again, it's all about focusing on the things you can affect and control. Life is too short to become totally obsessed over something. In a lot of situations you'll be able to find an ironic humour - even when you print a cover with no f*cking wheels on the car!

[Mr Horner, bless him, is referring to the August 2015 edition of F1 Racing, which featured an RB11, sans wheels, jacked up on bricks as the main image, under the coverline: 'How the wheels fell off Red Bull'. It led to, shall we say, a robust exchange of views - now amicably resolved...]

F1R: Do you ever think about life 10 years down the line? Will you be doing the same job, do you think? Or a version of this job, perhaps representing the sport in a wider way?

CH: Honestly, I really enjoy what I'm doing here, although the challenges of Formula 1 can be extremely demanding because you find yourself being judged every two weeks.
I have a real affinity and commitment to this team, and I'm not thinking... [He tails off momentarily, perhaps casting his mind to a secretly envisioned future existence...] I mean, who knows what Formula 1 will look like in three, four, five, 10 years' time?

F1R: Do you think that Red Bull might end up buying the commercial rights to Formula 1?

CH: I doubt it. I'd never say never, but I'd be very surprised.

F1R: Mateschitz quite likes owning things, though: two F1 teams, a racetrack, The Red Bull Air Race, Hangar-7 at Salzburg airport, a major commercial interest in the World Rally Championship

CH: I'd say that he likes creating things, like the Air Race. They're all interesting entities. And of course we've got Red Bull TV coming next year, which is a massive thing.

Hamilton approached Red Bull on more than one occasion, but Horner advised Mercedes to get in touch © LAT

F1R: Mark Webber wrote a few spiky things about you in his autobiography, which was published recently. Did you read that?

CH: To be honest, I haven't read Mark's book. Inevitably he's going to have an opinion, and that will of course be whatever he perceives. Reality is sometimes quite different to perception but I was really pleased for him, to see him become a world champion in sportscars, and I have no ill feeling towards Mark. I wish him the best of luck for the future.

F1R: Do you remember back in Canada in 2011 when Lewis [Hamilton, then driving for McLaren, but growing increasingly disillusioned about his future prospects with the team] popped in to have a chat? What really happened?

CH: He wanted to drive for Red Bull. It wasn't the only time he approached us; he was desperate to drive for the team, actually. In 2012, he wanted to come and drive for us, but there was no way we could accommodate him while Sebastian was with us. Then before he signed for Mercedes he was very keen to drive for Red Bull for 2013.

The McLaren had been very competitive in 2011 and 2012 and I thought it would probably be better for us for him to be at Mercedes than McLaren, so in the event of us not being able to sign him I encouraged Niki Lauda to sign him to weaken McLaren - not envisaging that Mercedes would become the absolute powerhouse they are today.

F1R: So Lewis owes you a drink?

CH: No, Niki Lauda owes me a drink! What Lewis has gone on to achieve, he was going to achieve that anyway. He's done an amazing job. He's a deserving champion.

The February 2016 issue of F1 Racing is now on sale, featuring an in-depth analysis of Renault's works return to F1; an assessment of Maurizio Arrivabene's first year in charge of Ferrari, plus part two in the 'history of F1' series.

All this plus regulars Pat Symonds, Damon Hill, Peter Windsor, Dieter Rencken and Murray Walker.